question about this forum that I need to know

[woundedbear]

First of all I am new to this forum, so hello everyone. I am woundedbear ,and have some experince building Guillow's kits. I have very fond memories of building Guillow's airplanes as a kid,"I'm 57 years old now". I can recall the joy of flying those Guillow's stick rubber powered planes. Now that Guillows has started producing lased cut kits, I think many more old people like myself will be coming back to this great hobby. I am currently working on a P-51 and Zero from the 400 series, with a 300 series Piper Cub and a 700 series Arrow waiting in the wings. However I have one question, is this forum for rubber powered free flight only? Or is converting Guillow's kits to radio control discussed here, not wanting to sound hostile, If it is not I'll still remain here, as I also enjoy building free flight, radio control, and static display aircraft. And will find another forum about radio control conversions to answer my questions about that part of the hobby. I also want to have a place to ask questions about free flight as I am interested in that hobby too. In fact I have a free flight question about Guillow's airplanes. I am trying something with my P-51 kit that I don't think anybody has ever done, converting the wing to a scale laminer flow airfoil design, does anyone know if this has been done? There are many questions about this project. Will I have to change the angle of incidence, and what about washout? Thanks to anyone who can answer these and all of the other questions I have.

[Bill Gaylord]

The P51 is one of the best flying conversions I have. As a rule of thumb, I've found that setting the flat bottom portion of the wing parallel with the stab will reduce or eliminate speed related climb issues, possibly with slight downthrust also. A simple modification to the bottom front of the airfoil for a better phillips entry seems to help also, which was done to the model. This was an old build that I built a precision wing for, a few years back. It has somewhere in the neighborhood of 1-2 degrees washout. I put a lot of effort into the precision and it really paid off. Never hit a click of trim and was dead on.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2368&p=15213&hilit=p51+rc#p15213

[Mitch]

Welcome,

There are no rules about the constructions we talk about. But I like to build for rubber power as I like the challenge. So I have no experience with other types of power. But there are those who do.

Mitch

[davidchoate]

Bill, for your Phillips entry, are you using round wood, or arbon fiber?. I was using 1/8" square . is that ok?

[Brenda]

I use to do R/C conversion back in the day. Now however I prefer control line nitro burners. The smell off a Cox motor brings back good memories. Also $10 for a powerplant is a good deal.

[woundedbear]

Thanks guys, Bill that P-51 of your's is fantastic ! I'm a bit of a P-51 freak myself, I wish I could do a P-51-B. Has anyone on the forum had any luck with turning the Guillows P-51-D kit, "either the 400 or 900 series", into a B model? Bill how did you build the aileron servos in your Mustang? By the way have any of you guys ever seen the Spitfire Mk 22 24? now those were beautiful airplanes! A company in England, I think its "westwing or westwind" makes one in 1/24th scale. Well keep'em flying everybody. My quote is, there no stupid questions just stupid people that keep asking them lol later taters

[woundedbear]

Thanks guys, Bill that P-51 of your's is fantastic ! I'm a bit of a P-51 freak myself, I wish I could do a P-51-B. Has anyone on the forum had any luck with turning the Guillows P-51-D kit, "either the 400 or 900 series", into a B model? Bill how did you build the aileron servos in your Mustang? By the way have any of you guys ever seen the Spitfire Mk 22 24? now those were beautiful airplanes! A company in England, I think its "westwing or westwind" makes one in 1/24th scale. Well keep'em flying everybody. My quote is, there no stupid questions just stupid people that keep asking them lol later taters

[Bill Gaylord]

Thanks guys, Bill that P-51 of your's is fantastic ! I'm a bit of a P-51 freak myself, I wish I could do a P-51-B. Has anyone on the forum had any luck with turning the Guillows P-51-D kit, "either the 400 or 900 series", into a B model? Bill how did you build the aileron servos in your Mustang? By the way have any of you guys ever seen the Spitfire Mk 22 24? now those were beautiful airplanes! A company in England, I think its "westwing or westwind" makes one in 1/24th scale. Well keep'em flying everybody. My quote is, there no stupid questions just stupid people that keep asking them lol later taters

You have to use small servos to fit in the wing ribs such as the BA 2.5, GWS Pico, and IFlight 3.1. After cutting out the servo hole in the wing rib, you can reinforce the bottom of the cutout with a balsa stringer that sits flush against the wing bottom surface. I double up the balsa where the servo screws mount with a small square of 1/16" balsa, mounted on the opposite side of the former from where the servo mounting ear sits. The glue laminate layer in-between also provides a more secure screw threading. There's a photo of this in my current FW190 thread here.

I believe someone did build the P51 kit as a B or C version. You could probably find it with some different search terms. RC Groups has a Guillows conversion sticky thread also in their Scale/Scratch Built forum. You just reminded me I should send a message to Phil about the 190 I'm doing now.

[David Lewis]

"I am trying something with my P-51 kit that I don't think anybody has ever done, converting the wing to a scale laminer flow airfoil design, does anyone know if this has been done?"

I haven't tried it but my prediction is that a scale airfoil would have a low maximum lift coefficient and, since the Reynold's number is very low, the boundary layer would be largely turbulent.

[Bill Gaylord]

"I am trying something with my P-51 kit that I don't think anybody has ever done, converting the wing to a scale laminer flow airfoil design, does anyone know if this has been done?"

I haven't tried it but my prediction is that a scale airfoil would have a low maximum lift coefficient and, since the Reynold's number is very low, the boundary layer would be largely turbulent.

That's been my understanding, that it wouldn't scale well for a model this size. I would find sections that work well on smaller models, while still looking scale for the P51. Other issues are creating a razor sharp TE, which isn't durable and tends to break up when covering the model, unless laminated with a glue after forming.

Here are the P51 sections on pg.5: http://www.dept.aoe.vt.edu/~mason/Mason ... ustang.pdf
The E169 and E171 sections look close, and are low Reynolds number sections more suitable for smaller r/c:
http://airfoiltools.com/search/list?page=e

I built and recently flew a Miles Aerovan, with the goal of wing sections that look scale in appearance. The 23012 and 2412 airfoils selected were close to scale and also worked well for the 36" span model. Creating the transition section requires a bit of effort, but it all seemed to work well:
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showpos ... stcount=22
In flight: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTAuLG3 ... e=youtu.be

BTW, I like the West Wings models, but I wish they were a hair larger. The Guillows FW190 at 25.75" span is about as small as I care to go, for an r/c warbird with some scale detailing.