Hello and my attempt at a Guillows Super Piper Cub 95 (602)

[BassettsAllSorts]

Hi All

I have finally had my account approved so I can say hello to everyone.

I'm 28 from the UK and I got a Guillow's Fokker D8 kit from my dad when I was around 8 years old and to be honest I was a little too young for it. I got some help from a local older guy but I never saw it again. I always felt bad about it and I was chatting to my wife a few weeks ago and I brought it up and we happened to come across a model shop with some kits in it so I took the plunge. I got the 900 series P51 Mustang. The build went very well and after starting to attach with dope I moved onto the UHU glue stick after reading threads on this forum (My wife is pregnant and we live in a flat so fumes were an issue).

I was happy with the tissue job/shrinking for a first attempt but when I doped the tissue to seal it, after getting advice from a friend at his workshop, I didn't thin the dope down and 20% of the tissue came came away from the frame (It was a shrinking dope). I repaired the sections but I should have done the lot again on the wings. I also suffered from some warping of the stabiliser and rudder. I should have gone with the information from this forum - oh well lesson learned! She flew although moving to the left, however when trimming to improve the distance she stalled and landed nose first which caused some damage which I need to sort out at some point.

Anyway I thought I would go for a 600 series easy build model while I source some balsa to fix the p51 and I went for the Piper Super Cub 95. The build went well and I really enjoyed putting this one together. I will try and put some photos on here so we shall see how that goes! Oh and please don't laugh I am new to this hobby but I have got to say I'm hooked!

Stabiliser and Rudder



Wing construction



Fuselage





I bought some red and yellow tissue so that I don't have to paint it. I've done the wings, stabiliser, rudder and half the fuselage so i'll be ready for shrinking/sealing soon which brings me to my questions. If someone could help me I will be really grateful.

What is the UK alternative to elmers/titebond glue for attaching tissue?
I have bought some banana oil to seal the tissue following advice on here - Do I have to thin this down 50/50?

I did search the forum but I couldn't clear these questions up.

Thank you in advance and I will post the finished plane when I get in done and hopefully fingers crossed a shot of her flying weather permitting.

Sorry for the long post but here are a couple from my mustang build! I didn't finish with decals and paint as I thought it would smash into a million pieces when I tried to fly it as it was my first attempt!






Nice to be on here and looking forward to building more planes and hopefully seeing them fly and fly well!! I've got a 500 series hurricane and spitfire in the locker but I might pick up a cessna 180 and belatedly join the group build when I finish the cub.

Take it easy and again if anyone can help that would be great!!

Tom

[Phugoid]

Hi Tom,

No laughter here, a good job all round....

Yes! - get that 180 kit and join in.

Thin the banana oil 50/50 with cellulose thinners, just good old PVA 50/50 with water is what you use to attach the tissue.

I'm from the UK too (Derby) so if you need advice on supplies etc I can usually help.

Andrew

[BassettsAllSorts]

Hi Andrew

Thank you for the speedy reply, I figured that it would be normal PVA but I didn't want to buy more supplies.

I bought the thinner with my order of banana oil just in case so I'll give that a go. I just hope the glue holds on the tissue this time - it was rather demoralising when it came away. I've tried to overlap the tissue on this cover job to see if that improves the hold.

I'll try and pick up a 180 although my nearest comprehensively stocked model shop is a good 45 minutes away. I was going to buy the 180 at the time but my dad who was with me said to get the WW2 kits as I had the cub! I really should have just bought it!

I'll post pics when I have shrunk the tissue and sealed it. Then the dreaded decals!

Thanks for the offer of advice I'm sure I'll be calling on you a lot! I'm in Hertfordshire myself.

I wish I could get hold of the Fokker D8 to finish what I started years ago but the only ones on ebay are in the states - I'll keep an eye out!

Tom

[Phugoid]

Hi Tom,

You shouldn't have any problem with the tissue coming away. BTW if you want to make these things fly the kit is a reasonable start but you'll need 3 more specialist things.

1) Rubber lube (it's not what you might initially think it is?!) te he

2) A winder (saves sore fingers)

3) some decent rubber (the stuff in Guillows kits is useless).

I Think I used 3/16" rubber on my cub, It's a long build thread but the details are toward the end:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1748

all of the above things can be bough from SAMS.

http://www.samsmodels.com/

I lived in Hatfield/ St. Albans for four years in the early 1990's, so I know ("knew" now I guess) that part of Hertfordshire quite well.....

[BassettsAllSorts]

Well funnily enough I used your thread as a reference and I bought the banana oil and thinners from SAMS as per your recommendation. I bookmarked the link because of the great info as well as your and scigs covering techniques. Fantastic information

I've got to say your cub looked fantastic when it was finished and the flight video was really good to watch. Hopefully one day I'll be making them to that standard.

I also bought the 3/16 rubber and rubber lube so hopefully when I get it finished I might have a result! Or it will smash to bits but the fun is in the trying! Figuring out the length of rubber to add should be fun!

The only thing I am lacking is the winder. Is there a particular brand that I should get?

Should I get the decal fix as well as opposed to the warm water on the instructions? My local hobby craft stocks that I think.

I did a Spanish evening course in Hatfield last year at the Uni. I'm near Stansted airport about 45 minutes from Hatfield.

[Phugoid]

The winder is a KP one the 10:1 ratio is fine for small/indoor models. it's about £10 or so

http://www.samsmodels.com/acatalog/Sect ... ers__.html

I think that it's item L2 on that page....

To be honest I've never tried the decal fix on plain doped tissue, I often paint my models, and if I don't paint them and have a natural tissue finish, I generally make my decals from tissue.........

Yeah I was at the Uni, at the college lane site in Hatfield

[BassettsAllSorts]

Thanks for the recommendation on the winder I'll get my order in at some point. the 4.50 postage is the killer so I'll wait until I get a good order list.

I did some more work on the applying the tissue last night and I'm nearly ready for the misting and doping. I'm reasonably happy for a second attempt and I'm hoping it will shrink down a little bit when misting.



I thought the Uni at Hatfield was really good - nice and modern but parking was an issue!

Thanks again for all your help. I'm trying to source a Cessna 180 with cheap postage!

Tom

[Phugoid]

Hi Tom,

Don't forget to pin/weight/clamp all of the flying surfaces down whilst you shrink the tissue and again when you dope it. Again refering to my build you'll see what i mean......

Andrew

[BassettsAllSorts]

Hi Andrew

Yeah I weighed the wings, stabiliser and rudder down. I realised that I had done the rubber yellow instead of red last night. I must have been daydreaming!

After shrinking it highlighted my inexperience. The wings didn't tighten up very well in places, even the old saliva trick I had read about didn't do the business. I was thinking of redoing the wings but I've only just started making these models so I can't expect miracles.









I'm just trying to think how to pin down the parts when I dope the tissue. I don't want it to stick when I do it oh and how to fix the windows on!

Tom

[ADW 123]

i use balsa riser (pieces of balsa 3/32" high) to keep the dope from touching the board. it doesnt really like sticking to the wood anyways.

[rayd]

Hi BassetAllsorts.....hey, is Tom ok? Call me Ray. I've been looking at your work, and glad our good buddy across the pond, aka Phugoid (Andrew) has touched base with you. You're a young fellow with that certain gift of artistry important in this hobby, I'm a retiree trying to get back into it after decades out of the hobby doing other things. (I'm kind of rusty, especially in the newer supplies dept.) In view of all the changes, supplies, stores or fewer hobby shops, availability...we've things in common. Say, do join Phugoids build the Cessna if you can or just follow along, armchair style...he's a nice guy, and has some good tips, for so called "newbies" like yourself...and for some rusty returnees like yours truly, but anybody can get some useful pointers and tips.

Based on your photos and comments, I think you've likely skills for most other Guillows items. For now, maybe avoid things like the large bombers, transports and such....but sure, think you're ready for...hmm, a favorite of mine, the large Spitfire eg (a legend for sure)...and its now available laser cut, dunno availability your way...but its a great plane, and if you like bipes, the SE-5 laser cut is also good, and has a long nose which is good if you'd want to get into R/C someday. I think you could manage planes like this, you've got that artistic ability for this. Do be careful with those supplies though....fumes are not good for the better half, especially now. Maybe work in a shop or use alternative supplies in the flat....Andrew is a nice chap and can help recommend with supplies in UK, and others here will try our best. Hmm...I can't resist inquiring about this, but I'll bet you enjoy licorice....yes? no? Ok, well I do....in any case, good luck, welcome aboard, and prepare to be called...Daddy.

[ADW 123]

I got myself a room downstairs, so no one can smell the chemicals that im using.

[Phugoid]

Hi Tom,

Your covering looks pretty good to me, don't worry about the odd little wrinkle, at the end of the day if the surfaces aren't warped and the thing is built nice and straight it's still going to fly. All this stuff takes a bit of practice that's all. I think that the wrinkles near the wing root may be because of the balsa shifting (so called "stress wrinkles") did you add any gussets in the corners?

Although the banana oil isn't a shriking dope it can pull out some "slack bits" so it's not over yet.

Looking forward to seeing the rest of your build

Andrew

[ADW 123]

also reduce the curvature of the front of the ribs dramatically. those wrinkles will always show up there if the curvature isnt reduced, and it doesnt blend nicely with the leading edge. the same goes for the trailing edge and the rear of the ribs in respect to it blending in neatly and evently with the TE.

[BassettsAllSorts]

Hi ADW, Andrew and Ray

Thanks for the information on the riser. I used some of the leftover wood and a bit of wax paper to stop it sticking. I then used whatever I could find to weigh it down. I stole a steel pan holder from the kitchen (Hoping the wife doesn't notice) for the wings and I went for it. I really liked the banana oil and the finish is pretty good. Definitely going to sand the front of the ribs down more - its mad how much you learn doing this! Wish I had a workshop but then my wife would never see me! A friend of mind has some outbuildings so I'll sweet talk him.

I'll hopefully finish it soon, I'll upload some more pictures tomorrow when I'm at work. I doped and did the two coats - Its cool when the paper goes transparent. From what I can see no major warping or issues so its looking pretty good at the moment.

Andrew gussets are definitely the order of the day for the next build. I didn't go for it and I think I paid for it but hey its a learning game and the dope has tightened it a little more. I definitely need to source some balsa to keep as stock and from what I have read on here it can be a lifesaver when the wood is not quite up to the job in the kits. Any recommendations for a supplier?

Ray thank you for the kind words and Tom is no problem. I bought some PVA today so I might try to seal it with that on the next build as an experiment. At least then I can do it in my flat and not worry about fumes. I have bought the 500 series spitfire and hurricane to build so I'll work through those at some point before moving onto the laser cut bigger models. I'm finding it hard to get them over here but I'm sure I'll get one at some point. Really looking forward to trying the laser cut kits.

I would love to get into RC at some point, however, I would not know where to start. I'll have to see if there are any local clubs around. I bet there is nothing more satisfying than building and flying your own model especially a WW2 plane. I know ill feel that way if I can get the super cub to fly!

I have found a fokker D8 on ebay today in the states so I might have a bid to see if I can get it to finish the kit that I couldn't do when I was a kid...unfinished business!

I don't really like licorice but every now and then I have a dabble.

One thing do you think I'll get the decals on top of the two coats of dope or should I just avoid that for this build. I know that Andrew paints his models so they go on better.

Thanks for you all taking time to reply and I'll post some pictures tomorrow.

Tom