Guillows Float Beaver for micro rc

[Bill Gaylord]

Now that's very interesting! I did not know that you could paint Microlite.

Many people don't, as they recommend not to. I'm one of those people that says when told something can't be done, "That's nice, now move along so I can get on with doing it". I can't count the number of experts that told me Guillows planes would never fly as electrics, at anywhere near the AUWs some of us are at with sheeting and scale details.

I've painted Microlite numerous times with enamel and lacquer sprays with no major problems. The little Guillows FW190 posted in another thread was a Microlite covered plane, painted over. Pat Tritle uses vinegar to etch the covering for better adhesion. A bit of chipping for flying planes is pretty much unavoidable, but it's not as if the wind blows the paint off. Landing in tall grass/weeds tends to chip my wing LEs a bit. Sometimes the covering will considerably relax when spraying, but will generally shrink fully tight again after a full day of drying. The added thinner in airbrush painting will cause it to do this. Patient application of coats obviously helps with minimizing this effect. When a few loose areas remain, I've been able to take care of them with a high power hair dryer. I've found that positioning them a good 5 feet below a sunlamp will not only increase drying, but take care of pretty much all reshrinking issues. I'll do that, moving the parts around to expose different part surfaces to the light. I say 5 feet, as too close will cause it to shrink itself off of the framework.

This job spayed well, with no major slacking issues. I found a few small areas in the ailerons and wingtip area that shrunk with a hair dryer. With a metallic gloss, the paint has to flow out for a good gloss, forcing you to somewhat pile it on a bit. Worked out about as well as I could ask for.

[Bill Gaylord]

When I got this kit, I had been thinking about building a park size Beaver of around 36", and have a set of GWS floats on hand for a build. I'm seriously thinking about enlarging the plans for a larger build, as this kit is not only well designed, but very scale. I've seen a few Beaver kits in the park size range, but they were miles off scale. With sculpted inset planking used in the curved areas and nose, this design produces a very scale looking build, right down to small details such as the front roof to wing transition. Really pleased with this one. I think I'll have to get it to a pond and take a picture for submission to the Guillows monthly build photos.

[cliffm]

Very nice build and outstanding posts. I'm currently building a 172 for a friend(just for scale),and this looks like it would be a nice subject for r.c. with all the room it has and the way the wing is designed for the kit, as with most Guillows it seems built sturdy enough, anyways thanks again for such a well constructed posting to the forum.

[Bill Gaylord]

Very nice build and outstanding posts. I'm currently building a 172 for a friend(just for scale),and this looks like it would be a nice subject for r.c. with all the room it has and the way the wing is designed for the kit, as with most Guillows it seems built sturdy enough, anyways thanks again for such a well constructed posting to the forum.

The 172 is one of the best Guillows rc candidates. I've heard concerns about the 1 piece plastic cabin window assembly, but it's actually a very strong part. With strong wing struts and attachment points, it serves simply as a wing locator, and is very strong for that purpose. I reinforced the strut mounting points and can remove the wing by removing screws in the strut ends, for aileron servo access. Likely one of the best park size 172 designs I've seen, with the molded canopy feature. I built one a few years ago and it's an excellent flyer. I would think that this model would be built more often than it is. It is roomy as you say, and even can have a scale interior. BTW, the molded wingtips with wingtip lights and molded rudder light bezel were just asking for scale lights, which talked me into installing an MPI lighting system.

[Pauli72]

That's one heck of a nice lookin' Beaver! Cant wait to see the flight video!

Great job Bill.

[Steve Blanchard]

In the immortal words of Detective Frank Drebbin "Nice Beaver!"

[Bill Gaylord]

Thanks for the comments. Steve I imagine you are referring to "Airplane" Frank.
I should get this one in the air soon. The controls are working well and I'm really optimistic about it flying well. Being on my old 72MHz radio, I have no programming. The throw rates seem ideal, which isn't always the case, and the control surfaces are centering well also.

Almost forgot the little "cigarette hanging out of the lip" exhaust pipe. Couldn't leave out that detail. I even had the hole cut out for it, but forgot about it. The hole location is actually indexed on the molded cowl, making it easy to place. The cowl also has molded panel lines which allow for easy alignment, as it is not a 100% symmetric cowl. These are nice little added details that the kit has.

[Pauli72]

Looks great Bill.

Just a quick question...

Do you permanently attach the cowel, or do you have it semi-permanently attached somehow?
Just wondering if / how often you need to get at an electric for maintainence.

I've never flown elecrtic, but the .049 planes I've had, all needed cowels that could be somewhat easily removed for access to the engine.

[ADW 123]

when i fly w/gas power, i dont even bother puting the cowl on

[Bill Gaylord]

Looks great Bill.

Just a quick question...

Do you permanently attach the cowel, or do you have it semi-permanently attached somehow?
Just wondering if / how often you need to get at an electric for maintenance.

I've never flown electric, but the .049 planes I've had, all needed cowels that could be somewhat easily removed for access to the engine.

Thanks.
Look back to the photos where the dummy engine is being built, and there are a few that show the attachment scheme. You'll see the thin ply tabs that stick out of the firewall and into the cowl area that are used for cowl fastening. Not exactly zoom focus, so you may have to look a bit to see them. There's a screw on either side of the cowl that fastens into the tabs for cowl removal. You can see one of these screw heads, in one of the pictures where the plane is sitting on the scale. Usually there are few problems with good electric gear, and you almost never need to get in again for servicing.
I've learned that if you don't make it serviceable, you will have to get in there again.

On the servicing thought, I left enough servo/ESC lead lengths to remove the receiver, and get it 1 inch outside of the plane. Good idea, as it had to come out again. I needed a JST connector for the aileron servos, and found one in the drawer, but without pins. I came up with the bright idea of using similar pins from another micro batt connector. The problem is that they did not have the microscopic leaf spring that I believe the correct pins have. I should have realized that the spacing in these female pins was maybe 0.002 wider than the male receiver pins. Without the leaf spring to make contact, the pins have to press onto the the mating pins, with an interference fit. I was fortunate to find an intermittent problem with the aileron servos on the bench. The problem was quickly found by moving the wires at the suspect connector with a stick. I then had to remove the receiver and remove the connector, crimping the pins and reinstalling the connector. Works fine now, but reinstalling that receiver in the 1"x1" door access and then rearranging the wires was a job. Before someone says, "Why didn't you buy the right pins or get a new connector?", the real issue is that you have to pay attention to every detail with micro gear, whether it is OEM or not. They want extortion level fees at the LHS for these connectors, and I'm too impatient to mail order, which is why I custom built one. I need to order some of these from an electronics distributor at reasonable cost, so that I have them on hand.

We'll have to get you into the electrics Pauli. When I first started in this, the conversions were much tougher with the heavier NiMh batts, and the gear was expensive. The gear is better and cheaper than ever. I've had a blast flying a number of these Guillows planes as electric rc flyers.

[Pauli72]

Thanks Bill,

As far as the cowel attachment goes, I looked at the firewall picture a second time, and I see what you mean. When I first looked at the pic, it didn't seem like there was enough meat for the cowel to grab onto, forward of the firewall. But when I enlarged the photo....I see what you mean.

As to me getting a Guillows R/C electric going, I was somewhat shocked when I saw how relatively inexpensive the R/C gear is now, compaired to when I took a balsa airplane building hiatus back in the late 80's/early 90's. Back then you needed a gas engine (at least $200.00), a decent minimum 4 or 5 channel radio & servos, ($250.00+), The airplane kit ($100.00 minimum), and another few hundred for flight box odds & ends. So what's that...$700.00 or $800.00 to get off the ground properly?
So I stuck with .049 Guillow's line control, and rubber power free-flight. There were even a few attempts at .049 free-flight ending with terrible results...LOL!

Since my return to building this last winter, after a 20 odd year hiatus, I was really happy to have stumbled across this Guillow's forum, and the Virtual Aerodrome site too. Right now I'm in the process of finishing up the Guillow's P-38. I've gone all out on this static display, with all the bells and whistles, (moveable control surfaces, working retracts, dropable bombs, fully detailed scratch cockpit, etc.) and It's taken longer than I thought it would. Perhaps after my next project, (a static display, scratch built, Me-262, that Bill Parker helped me find resource material, and plans for. -Bill is such a great guy!), I'll look a little more seriously at an electric Guillow's conversion. At least I'll know where to go for advice and info. LOL!

All the best for a problem-free maiden flight on the Beaver!
Pauli

[Bill Gaylord]

Thanks Bill,

As far as the cowel attachment goes, I looked at the firewall picture a second time, and I see what you mean. When I first looked at the pic, it didn't seem like there was enough meat for the cowel to grab onto, forward of the firewall. But when I enlarged the photo....I see what you mean.

As to me getting a Guillows R/C electric going, I was somewhat shocked when I saw how relatively inexpensive the R/C gear is now, compaired to when I took a balsa airplane building hiatus back in the late 80's/early 90's. Back then you needed a gas engine (at least $200.00), a decent minimum 4 or 5 channel radio & servos, ($250.00+), The airplane kit ($100.00 minimum), and another few hundred for flight box odds & ends. So what's that...$700.00 or $800.00 to get off the ground properly?
So I stuck with .049 Guillow's line control, and rubber power free-flight. There were even a few attempts at .049 free-flight ending with terrible results...LOL!

Since my return to building this last winter, after a 20 odd year hiatus, I was really happy to have stumbled across this Guillow's forum, and the Virtual Aerodrome site too. Right now I'm in the process of finishing up the Guillow's P-38. I've gone all out on this static display, with all the bells and whistles, (moveable control surfaces, working retracts, dropable bombs, fully detailed scratch cockpit, etc.) and It's taken longer than I thought it would. Perhaps after my next project, (a static display, scratch built, Me-262, that Bill Parker helped me find resource material, and plans for. -Bill is such a great guy!), I'll look a little more seriously at an electric Guillow's conversion. At least I'll know where to go for advice and info. LOL!

All the best for a problem-free maiden flight on the Beaver!
Pauli

Thanks, I hope it goes well.
The cowl pretty much would stay on, just with the locators which were part of the design. That was a nice feature, and I could have padded them a bit for a tight fit. I've heard of the prop pulling cowls forward into the prop however and decided to use screws. I was going to use micro rare earth magnets, but could not quite get the cowl and mating surface flush enough for a good fit,without 2 sets of magnets, and didn't want to add the weight. With most Guillows planes, I wouldn't have been concerned with the fit, but this cowl fits so well that I wanted the seam to be dead tight. The screws run right along the balsa plate glued into the rear of the cowl, so I was able to use them to "pull" the cowl tight, by drilling the holes in the tabs a few thousandths rearward.

As for the electric gear, I normally would spend little more on the entire project, than the Park180 motor costs. The Horizon/Eflite/Spektrum name brand stuff is expensive, but there's cheaper stuff as good if not better. It's absolutely possible to only spend $40 on the gear for a plane like this, and have the same performance as what's in this one. My motor of choice can be found from a number of places for a bit over $10. The little 2.4gm 72MHz receiver from BP Hobbies works well for $10, and I'm out of memories on my 2.4G unit, which makes it a good thing. The ESC I prefer, but not used here, is a 6A unit sold by a number of places including Hobbypartz for less than $10. I could kick myself for not ordering a number of inexpensive 2.5gm standard design servos, when I had the chance. I trust them more than the micro linear servos. The micro stuff is so popular now, that nobody seems to be able to keep the servos in stock. When the Blue Arrow 2.5 first came out they were $20. I've found good knock-offs for $2-5, which all have the same high resolution as the brand name. Years ago the cheapies had fewer steps, but in recent times the cheapies have been just as good.

The only issue I've had with the micro gear, is that you have to be delicate working with the intricate stuff. The first motor I bought for this plane was on closeout, likely because the wires were not strain relieved well, and hand to be flexed to fit a small cowl. I even went to the trouble of tying them off, and they STILL pulled enough inside the wire sheathing, so as to break a full inch away, inside the motor housing. After buying the Park180 for this plane, I actually repaired that motor, but it really wasn't practical for the time and effort. I had to insert a pintle iron tip inside a tiny window in the motor housing, and solder new leads onto 3 broken windings, broken off with only 1/16" of an inch sticking up, and only a bit thicker than a human hair. Next, the winding sets had to be identified. It's now strain relieved off with a big glob of thick CA. Amazingly it actually runs well again, but I won't trust it in this plane.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znvW_r9E-Fk