laser cutters who can cut Guillows kits

[woundedbear]

Hello everybody,
I have something I would like to run by all of you. I have two Guillows kits, the number 1001 kit ( the P-47) and the number 2001 kit (the P-38), These kits are not offered as laser cut kits by Guillows as of yet. I was wondering is there a company that could laser cut some of the kit's parts for me using some very nice balsa wood that I already have? Here's what I have in mind I have some balsa wood sheet. Some very nice Soft 6 to 9-pound wood and some Contest wood 4 to 6-pounds. What I'd like to do is to have the front formers from the B1s to the formers that come behind the trailing edge of the wings cut from the soft balsa wood sheet, and the rest of the formers behind the trailing edge of the wing back cut from the Contest wood. And have the vertical and horizontal stabilizers cut from the extra light Contest wood as well. The rest of the parts would be from the Guillows kit. Parts like the center keels, side keels, wing ribs, and trailing edges plus the stringer stock. Just having the parts that need to be lighter cut (laser cut) from the better wood. Are there companies that would cut just the parts you need from wood that you can provide?

[Bill Gaylord]

Without actual CAD parts files, the cost would be high. I haven't heard of a cutter that can interpret a scan, and if it could, the scan would have to be really clean. People have been working on things such as scanned lined drawings-to-DXF converters forever, and they're far from perfect. If you're cutting tail feather parts, I usually find it an advantage to use the plan to cut parts, but to change the joint convention to better take advantage of grain strength. It's another bonus, as well as using better wood.


I can't encourage people enough to hand cut parts. With the die-cut parts placed over the new wood, it's really simple with a sharp exacto. You catch onto tricks such as not cutting in the direction that cuts into the grain whenever possible, and gain skill really quickly. Several scores usually works best to maintain accuracy, versus cutting through in one shot. The P47 and P51 wings below were hand cut without templates. It's even more exciting when you take a simple 3-view and start cutting parts by hand. It's not terribly difficult to end up with parts at least as accurate as a die-cut kit. Duplicate parts are much easier, using the first part as a cutting template. Started on a micro HP 115 jet using a 3-view line drawing only 2 nights ago. Pretty much have the major frame up after a few hours of work.

[pedwards2932]

I use Inkscape to trace over plans that creates an .svg file that I use my craft cutter (Sizzix Eclips) to cut parts. It doesn't do notches that well but I use a file for those. You have to use an exacto to completely release the parts. It will cut through up to 1/16" but I have done 1/8th but there is an issue with the blade dragging across the balsa. I didn't have a problem with 3/32 only light drag marks. My cutter software will do tracings but if you zoom in on most plans you will see how rough the drawings are which is why they don't trace well.

[woundedbear]

WOW Bill you and pedwards2932, you two guys should have been surgeons I have tried to hand cut parts but just can't get the hang of it I have a scroll saw but haven't used it much. I spend way too much time online. I have made plans to get counseling for my internet addiction. I once could not understand how someone could become addicted to gambling then I started bidding on eBay. Now it is perfectly clear how a person could get hooked on gambling. When you're bidding on something that you and maybe two other guys know it's a real gem Your heart rate goes up as you try to place your bid at the last possible moment and you want to get the item for just 2 cents above the others who are trying to do the same thing It is quite exciting. and when you can manage to pull such a thing off it's very gratifying.

[pedwards2932]

All of my cuts were done by a craft cutter called Sizzix Eclips. I just trace the drawings on a plan and the machine cuts them out. It is not laser it uses a knife blade that you set the depth on. Made mainly for cardboard, posterboard or paper but it works with balsa.....not perfect but pretty darned good. I cut those parts in 2 passes and it took about 3 minutes total.

[Bill Gaylord]

Looks really interesting Pedwards. Very true about a number of hand drawn plans not being crisp. With a process such as yours, I imagine you become familiar with the tooling, and can tweak the tracing technique to adjust for the cutting width.

WOW Bill you and pedwards2932, you two guys should have been surgeons I have tried to hand cut parts but just can't get the hang of it I have a scroll saw but haven't used it much. I spend way too much time online. I have made plans to get counseling for my internet addiction. I once could not understand how someone could become addicted to gambling then I started bidding on eBay. Now it is perfectly clear how a person could get hooked on gambling. When you're bidding on something that you and maybe two other guys know it's a real gem Your heart rate goes up as you try to place your bid at the last possible moment and you want to get the item for just 2 cents above the others who are trying to do the same thing It is quite exciting. and when you can manage to pull such a thing off it's very gratifying.

You should have seen my first parts. I get a kick out of them, looking back. The skill develops quickly. I guess my main thing with any process other than a CAD file, is the translation errors tend to add up, making it easy to get the same quality from hand cutting. Pedward's method would really pay off, for making duplicate parts or several kits. Some of the CAD designs can even be worse than die-cut parts, when they trace a hand drawing and make parts from them, without actually laying the parts out in CAD. The only real benefit of LC parts, is if they come from a full blown, verified CAD design, otherwise translation errors add up. On those lines, that's why scoring the wood under a plan with a dull knife, used to create a guide line, has proven as accurate as any other method I've used. It doesn't cut through the plan, and doesn't require printing templates. It sounds crude, but what I've found with templates is that first you have the deviation of cutting out the parts with scissors, then there is a deviation from cutting around the template edge. At the end of the day, the stack up error is no different than scoring on the hand drawn part lines, and using that score as a guide to cut the parts out.

[pedwards2932]

With my process I can cut parts out of poster board to see if they need any mods saves balsa. With the Mooney plan I was using in the pictures I have found the formers need a little more beef especially since I want to try to make it work out as an electric. I am doing it first as rubber powered to see how it will fly. I have already modified the wing connection point. My next project is to make mods to the Guillow Spitfire so it will be lighter, use a different airfoil, and a built up cowl. Here is a quick video of my craft cutter in action (it will also cut decals out very precisely). It takes awhile to start and it shows 2 passes and adjust the blade depth on the second pass.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRvv4myOlFI

[Bill Gaylord]

The cutter moves along pretty quickly. Faster than I would have thought.

[Steve Blanchard]

You should really avoid using super soft balsa for the tail. You will more than likely get warps. To save weight you are better off making laminated outlines for the tail group.

[SteveM]

It doesn't help you now, but Guillow's has had the P-38 laser cut in the works for a couple years and could roll it out at any time.

[davidchoate]

I once took a plan I wanted enlarged to a professional Engineering Printer because it's directly across the street from My Work, and they wanted a couple hundred bucks because they do not simply copy or scan it into a A program like Windows Word or Photo Shop and then enlarge it a certain percentage. They would have to take the dimensions and add them into a CAD program and give it to Me Printed, but also on a Memory device for future purposes. Laser Cutting more than likely would be easy from that point. So 3 or 4 hundred bucks from a Professional Engineering Place is what I guess it would cost to get it ready for a LC Cutter. I do not know what CAD software costs, or what the time would be to get good with it. I know ,because I learned it in school in the 80's, how to draw by hand Engineering Drawings. With a T-square, triangle, and compass as Primary tools, but when they introduced CAD I dropped out because it was not fulfilling My interests anymore. But anyway Woundedbear. send Me your address and stuff. I will get You a copy of the plan for the Mosquito. But You're taping it together. I also got some other Plans for a Piper Pacer RC 20" wing span. But designed from plans for RC using easy to acquire E-flite stuff, and it is a good Plane to learn how to fit the RC gear into a Guillows Kit. I have as well a Plan for a Balsa Helicopter. A Sikorsky . That I got from David Duckett, and I know I'm never going to attempt it,but think You might. Given You're Obsessive Nature with Impossible Ideas.LOL

[woundedbear]

Hello! SteveM,
I would love to have two sets laser cut balsa wood sheets for the Guillows P-38 kit# 2001. I think that the sooner that Guillows gets all of their current line of model airplanes into laser cut form the better. I have heard there are a few guys who prefer the die cut kits, for those who like the die cut kits I think there will be a good supply of those around for a long time to come. I have noticed that with the die cut kits the parts that are aligned with the grain of the wood tend to be the easiest to get out of a die cut sheets. While the parts that curve around across the grain are the most difficult and if those parts that curve across the grain are small as well they will always break this is a particularly true with the smallest of the formers (the B13, B14, and B15) parts on both of my two P-38 Kit# 2001s are going to have to be recut. If I could get those laser cut I would have for the most part two really good P-38 kits. I have a scroll saw that I need to start using. Since buying it I haven't used it much, I managed to get some Flyingdutchman blades but haven't really tried to use it. For some reason, the superfine blades want to flex and the 0.2 and 0.3 blades are difficult to install, but they have very fine teeth (I have one set of a dozen that are of the spiral type with 64 teeth per inch!) I have been in kind of a slump all this winter to tell the truth. One of the guys here on the forum made the comment that I am obsessive,"how did he know! " But it is true , my father was a perfectionist so was my Mom so I turned out to be an obsessive type. Yep. An Obsessive, BI-Polar, Dyslexic, Arthritic Hippie who survived drugs, that's me alright!

[pedwards2932]

Inkscape is free and it is a pretty decent program for CAD. Like any other program it takes a while to get used to it. As far as learning how to use it you just have to practice a bit. It takes me any where from a half hour to an hour to trace out most plans (sometimes parts are repeated like ribs). Now that said I work with computers for a living and have some graphic experience. Once you create the trace of the parts you can set up your template for cutting, main deal is getting them in a format that the cutter understands in my case .svg. My parts when you lay them on the plans are an exact match only issue I have is with hand drawn plans the lines aren't very accurate and you have to interpret a bit because of the precision of the computer. I know this isn't for everyone but for me I am able to combine a hobby I love with a computer which makes it even more fun for me.

[davidchoate]

You are lucky to have access to and a good understanding of computers. I am working with an old laptop with Windows Vista! My phone is faster than this thing. I fixed a neighbors Car, and He was really broke so I got paid by Him giving Me a brand new wireless HP all in one Printer. They go for about $100 new. So when the color ink goes empty I may chuck it. Most of us Geezers who still build Planes are not super computer savvy, but I am getting better. I can type with both hands. I don't "Peck" at the keys anymore. But anyway having a copy machine handy is great for duplicating just the part of the plans I am building over. This printer does print good photos. I think that's what it's made for, and so I want to try that Decal Paper. I like water slide decals. Everyone but Guillows and plastic display models use just a clear thick sticker with decals printed on them. Dumas makes some nice kits for example. Super light, Good flying, with nice tissue, and wood then they give You a super glossy ,thick, and heavy sticker for decals. If Guillows did anything good it was keeping the water slide decals. I understand that water decal paper is now easily available. And I like to make a warbird with different markings than all the others.

[woundedbear]

Hello! davidchoate, I'm an old geezer myself when I type I use both hands too, just use only my index fingers, though . My HP personal computer has windows 8 I wish they still supported windows XP. I got my first computer of my own around Christmas 2014. I was using an old Dell that someone close to me let me use,"she's a real good friend", It used window's XP. Windows XP ran for about 12 years and was a good program for beginners, it was self-explanatory and was used to get everybody on line . We are a computer dependent species now and everything has changed. The Malls are all closing, even the once mighty Wal-Mart is on it's way out. We will soon be buying everything through the computers, that have taken over everything . I can see the day where you will even buy all of your groceries with a computer. There will be days when the grocery trucks will be making deliveries in the different neighborhoods and you will have to have your grocery list sent into the central store where the food is kept. Yep, every day little by little we will lose our freedoms, our right to choose . The Brave New World is here , what will the country we were born into become America will not be a manufacturing country that's much is for certain. America will be the world's police force, you will either be in the armed forces or you will provide some kind of service for the armed forces. You will either build the weponds for the military or you will build housing for military families, or service the things military families need, things like their cars, air conditioners, refrigerators etc... If any country crosses the line the American police force will deal with them, in short order We have the most powerful Navy the world has ever seen. Our Navy can reach any country on the face of the earth. We can project our air power to countries that don't even have a coastline Yep! The times they are ah' changing. But take heart Jesus is coming and boy is he pissed